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Post by Dale Martens on Nov 29, 2003 10:33:27 GMT -6
If you're making your own leaders, what do you think would be appropriate butt material for 3, 5, 7, 9, and 11 wt. lines?
Also, for a 9 ft. leader, how long would you make your butt section and what's the fewest number of "intermediate" sections that you think you could get away with between the butt and the tippet?
Dale
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Robert Burton
Fly Fishing Zombie
Eventually all things merge into one, and a river runs through it.
Posts: 4,744
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Post by Robert Burton on Nov 29, 2003 15:19:52 GMT -6
I will tell ya what i have learned and what i do and hopefully there might be something in it for you to use. First off there is a major difference in leaders for dry fly fishing and everything else. For dry fly leaders i use the George Harvey "slack" leader formula. Most leader formulas call for 60% butt and 40% taper (although the butt section can be 2-4 sections of taper) A Harvey leader is made thus. >18" .015<>18" .013<>18" .011<>18" .009><15" 3x><36" 4x< For streamers and nymphs i just adjust this formula (of 6 sections) to fit the "X" factor. For butt material i use Maxima Chameleon in brown (as that is all that we can get around here) and it it very stiff and turns over very well and the X sections are Orvis Super Strong. I have a chart that gives the true diameter and the true lb test of the Maxima if you need or want it. rb
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Post by Dale Martens on Nov 30, 2003 18:57:21 GMT -6
I'm not the most ambitious person when it comes to tying knots... Rob, have you every tried a simpler version of the leader you describe in your post ?
If I were to build a 9 ft. leader that consisted of only three sections - butt, middle, and tippet - what might it look like? Would it still perform reasonably well?
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Robert Burton
Fly Fishing Zombie
Eventually all things merge into one, and a river runs through it.
Posts: 4,744
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Post by Robert Burton on Dec 1, 2003 9:18:56 GMT -6
For drys no it would not peform well but for most warm water it would be "ok" The problem is that the butt section needs to be 2/3rds the diameter of the fly line (at the connection) and to make a 4x leader in 3 sections would require a butt section of 15-20lb mono a tippet of 4x (6lb) and then your middle 3rd of what?? Say 10lb ok then we remember the "X" rule that you can't (who says) go bigger than 2 X's when attaching 2 pieces of mono.
The simpest leader i make are my catfish leader. (OX) Well really my simplest leader is a pike leader 6' 20lb mono 3' American fishing wire. But here is the cat leader. 3' 15lb<>3' 12lb<>3'10lb<>3' 6 or 8lb< all Maxima. Factor in the knots and loop end you have a leader less than the 12' but more than the standard 9'. I really should call this my red river leader as the brown water makes this a walleye sauger goldeye drum leader. 6-8lb is enough to land those cats (so far) and has enough breaking strength to pull those bottom snags off but if the fly is lost i can break it off with out losing anything else. I pre tie my leaders over the long cold dark winter (and in between fishing trips) so i don't carry the material on the water. I put them in a leader wallet. I use the very simple double and triple surgeons knot. I precut the material tie em up and put em away. When on the water if i screw up i can save the butt section to build a new one later but i don't waste time on the water trying to save a $5-7 leader. But out side of dry fly fishing and some nymphing you can literally get away with a single piece of mono in the lb test you desire. The weight of bead/bullet head, bead chain or dumbell eyes is more than enough to turn over your leader especially in streamers. rb
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Post by darrellmyskiw on Dec 1, 2003 12:46:06 GMT -6
This may be an area I need to look more into developing, but for now - here's my 2-cents worth . . . I lieu of changing bought tippets every 4th or 5th fly I tie on, I generate my own. I only use a 2-piece system, leader being 5 - 6 ft of 10lb mono, and the tippet being 3-4 ft of (suitable per fly size) between 2 to 6 lb mono. I use a loop knot to join the 2 - so if I run short on tippet - I bite off the old tippet at the loop, and loop in a new strand. Now, I probably could break this into a 3 piece, to enlarge the line at the fly line, and I'd have to find the length ratio's to get the formula down. But . . . like I said - for now, it works for me ....... I haven't noticed much of a difference in the casting - unless I pooch it and the tippet is longer than the leader - but then again, I haven't gone through many store-bought tippets to make that comparison.
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Post by Dale Martens on Dec 1, 2003 19:29:29 GMT -6
Thanks for the ideas guys... Now I have a couple more things to try while the snow is on the ground.....
Dale
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